Friday, May 27, 2011

Re: [californiadisasters] Re: A why is it?

IMO as a moderator, this thread is getting way too OT. I replied to Linn's
post on the Discussion group; I'm replying to Louis' message here because I
think this is a very important (and volatile) subject and I hope to diffuse
this thread a little. However, please take all further discussion to the
Discussion group (not that it's on-topic there, but not as flagrant as being
here). Thanks.

IMO, one of the huge problems we have in sorting out our "melting pot"
society today is that we make typifications along racial lines when the
correlation between the subject we're talking about and racial lines is just
not that strong. (In fact, "multiculturalism" promotes this, pushing us to
see people as in groups, rather than as individuals. Another "issue" IMO.)

"Ebonics"* is a good example of this. Many "African-Americans" do in fact
speak "Ebonics". Many do not. This is a cultural issue: People who grew up
in the Deep South, in urban neighborhoods, or in rural areas where Ebonics
was predominant learned, naturally, to speak it. People who grew up in the
North, the suburbs, etc., where Ebonics may have existed but was not
predominant, are unlikely to speak it.

(In the same way, although my grandfather's father was born and raised in
Cuba, my grandfather spoke English without accent [even that of his native
Brooklyn, NY!]. On the other hand, I personally know people who were born
and raised in the US who speak English with a pronounced Spanish accent.)

Another example: IMO, we have a problem in many areas (including where I
live) of non-performing students in the schools, and it seems to me that a
big hindrance to effectively dealing with the problem is that the issue of
race is superimposed onto the problem. The students who are not performing
(won't or can't) are predominantly "poor". By this I mean, "having poor
ways", not necessarily "economically disadvantaged" (although poor ways do
nothing to bring people above "disadvantaged"). While in my home area Blacks
and Hispanics are over-represented among the "poor" and Whites and Asians
are under-represented, there are "poor" but also achievers among every
cultural group and racial group.

And this seems a good place to do what those Amerindian students were doing,
and quit at this point without stating a conclusion!

* I'm very reluctantly using the word "Ebonics" here, primarily because I
don't want to get even way farther OT and way closer to talking politics
than we already are. Please take it in the present context to mean only the
dialect itself from a linguistic perspective, even though the word has a
significant political charge.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Louis N. Molino, Sr." <>
To: <>
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [californiadisasters] Re: A why is it?


The statement "With African American, it's "ebonics""

Is among the most inaccurate incorrect downright wring and frankly racist
statements I've heard on a list in a while.

Ebonics is an abomination and while the vast numbers of folks that speak it
are black the vast majority of African Americans certainty do not use
Ebonics on every day conversation.

Oh and I'm a white middle class republican male who makes about 6 figures
and I'm insulted.

Louis N. Molino, Sr. CET
Training Program Manager
Fire & Safety Specialists, Inc.
Typed by my fingers on my iPhone.
Please excuse any typos.
(979) 412-0890 (Cell)
(979) 690-7559 (Office)
(979) 690-7562 (Office Fax)

On May 27, 2011, at 18:38, wrote:

> With African American, it's "ebonics", and with Native Americans I suspect


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